I’d absolutely love to see TBC and WoTLK servers! If they do it on separate servers without interfering with classic or anything then it’s totally ok. I even want Cataclysm and MoP servers (But those would be unpopular) eventually, perhaps 3-5 years down the road. I started in WoD, so I’d love to see even later expansions despite how unpopular they might be.
No original unarmored epic mounts
My ideal world is progressive release of seperate TBC and WOTLK servers. Nothing else needed after that imo. End it with the holy trinity of wow.
Vennrick - Human Warrior
Keatts- Human Rogue
Grobbulus - US
Relik wrote: ↑5 years agoits practically guaranteed to be separate serversBlizzard Entertainment
Q: What are the plans after Phase 6? More content for classic or moving to TBC?
A: We’ve done most of the hard work by bringing back 1.12 so progressing to Burning Crusade would be a lot easier for us. Our plan is to identify everything we need to do should we ever decide to go this route. We want to be sensitive to the desires of our players. Some may want BC and some may not. We’ll be following the Classic community closely to help determine what our next steps should be.
What do you guys think about this answer?
I really hope that if they go down the route of re-releasing TBC and WotLK that they do it on separate servers where you can copy your character, otherwise we'll just be in the same situation 10 years down the line where people are asking for Classic servers again!
It's also kinda funny that Classic isn't even released yet and people are asking what's coming next.
Im sorry but its not a holy trinity.
Bc followed in the design of classic wow.
But wrath did not. Wrath was the beginning of modern wow. Not the end of the old.
I'll support most reasonable variations of classic+. I kinda worry about ones that borrow TBC content, but I'd be more interested in, instead of using TBC content and tooling it for level 60, to actually use the OG, prototype of Outland and the Hellfire Citadel. There is some old chatter and scribblings by Blizzard that the Dark Portal was going to be open to Outland during Vanilla, but if you've seen the videos, it's different from TBC Outland.
I'd be down for that.
Of course this reworked/re-prototyped Outland would also be cool to see in the game along with: Grim Batol, Uldum (raid was the original intent, not a zone), Dragon Isles, some way to use the Hyjal zone, and then one of the earlier versions of Karazhan that got scrapped.
For Hyjal, maybe a world boss, rare spawns, and stuff. An extra rep and quest hub, like a prototype of Quel'Danas island, or just a less bad version of Silithus content.
Of these, Grim Batol and Kara could be 20 man raids, providing for a full 20 man raid progression path for a small guild.
But if we have to use TBC content, I'm in favor of keeping the level cap at 60 and the entire game being centered on a single progression path. Might see about re-tooling the Outland content in the world as people won't need to level. But there's so many TBC instances, I don't know how you'd manage the gear without just totally obliterating the existing vanilla gear, or at least obsoleting a lot of it.
And I'm less jazzed about the prospect of TBC servers. I feel like its a super safe, but boring option. If we only ever have this opportunity once, we might as well try out Classic+ content. If BC is so safe, and way easier for the devs to do, then that can be the fall-back plan.
And while I agree with that, let's also not ignore the glaring flaw of TBC: the obsoletion of all level 60 content in the game. All your progression is wiped out.
Thats a flaw of expansions in general.Gensei wrote: ↑5 years agoAnd while I agree with that, let's also not ignore the glaring flaw of TBC: the obsoletion of all level 60 content in the game. All your progression is wiped out.
Not necessarily. Blizzard didn't have to raise the level cap. Back in the day, them raising the level cap was semi-controversial. Some players liked it, some didn't care, but some definitely hated it. And hated the idea of Blizzard "stealth resetting" everyone's character back to the same level of power.Instinctz wrote: ↑5 years agoThats a flaw of expansions in general.Gensei wrote: ↑5 years agoAnd while I agree with that, let's also not ignore the glaring flaw of TBC: the obsoletion of all level 60 content in the game. All your progression is wiped out.
Let me rephrase. All existing expansions. As in what actually happened instead of hypothetical.Gensei wrote: ↑5 years agoNot necessarily. Blizzard didn't have to raise the level cap. Back in the day, them raising the level cap was semi-controversial. Some players liked it, some didn't care, but some definitely hated it. And hated the idea of Blizzard "stealth resetting" everyone's character back to the same level of power.Instinctz wrote: ↑5 years agoThats a flaw of expansions in general.Gensei wrote: ↑5 years agoAnd while I agree with that, let's also not ignore the glaring flaw of TBC: the obsoletion of all level 60 content in the game. All your progression is wiped out.
Just FYI, Classic already is named patch 1.13. The Blizzcon demo was 1.13, and the closed beta was on a 1.13.2 client. We're currently on 13.2.31446Firelord wrote: ↑5 years agoThe idea of TBC excites me, but so does a patch 1.13.
With TBC, we know what we are getting. We know what the game will be like and what comes with it. I definitely enjoyed TBC.
However, a patch 1.13 is a really interesting idea. A new experience in Classic, made in the spirit of Classic—that's what I like to believe at least. The question is whether we can trust Blizzard to make such a patch, and how far they will take it in terms of quality-of-life, because I would personally not want to see any.
If classic is even remotely successfull (Which I think we all here believe it will be), I cannot see a world where blizzard doesn't release TBC and Wrath.
I wouldn't be opposed to it as long as classic servers remain. Always have a free one way character transfer from vanilla to TBC and TBC to Wrath between the servers. This way, you can progress through history at your own pace. (No going backwards, do to leveling getting consistantly easier over time)
Classic+ is my prefered route, of course AFTER NAX has been released for many months.
My Buddies and I have been talking about classic+ changes we would like to see the following be the first "Classic+ Content Patch":
1. Remove debuff limit and rebalance boss encounters to maintain same difficulty after debuff limit remove.
This would allow for more varience in play styles and raid comp. Afflic Lock now relevant. I'm very interested to see how competitive feral druid will be now that they can maintain 2x bleeds at all times, etc. I think it is important to maintain difficultly level, allowing unlimited debuffs or drastically increasing them, would make fights easier, so rebalancing content will be required.
2. Implement pally taunt
Give pally a nice long ass class quest at lvl 30 class quest or somthing that takes them into everything undead and at the end grant them https://www.wowhead.com/spell=31789/righteous-defense
It was orriginally planned as vanilla content and they just never got around to doing it pre-tbc. Im not sure how Horde would like this, as they wouldn't really get an equivilent boon to their faction.
3. Implement a variety of new items lvl 1-52 itemized for various off specs. (*Give gear items to under itemized specs)
Not better loot, not more powerful loot, just different loot. I would like to see better itemization for those under itemized specs. Give some more variety to leveling. Smite priest? + holy damage cloth gear is available for you. Boomkin leveling? Sure... Elemental shaman leveling? Yup. The goal here is to just bring the other specs to be on par with the classes current designated leveling spec. (Shadow, Feral, Enhance...)
4. Impliment additional T1 and T2 and T3 gear items into the current raids for class off specs. (Currently only 1 tiered set per class, this would impliment the TBC model of 1 tier set per class per spec.)
Not sure if I like the gear token thing from TBC or not. I like the fact that the boss drops specific pieces of gear, on the other hand, 3x sets per class would mean getting any one piece of gear would be even more difficult. I do know that I like having gear for each spec. Once again, the goal here is not to make people more powerfull, but to offer class balance and more raid composition varriety. I think most class/spec issues in vanilla are not due to talents or spells, but because gear for the spec doesnt exist.
In the gearing, for both points 3 and 4, I want to ensure the slide to a unified "Spell Power" is avoided. Also, I don't want to change the theory of thought between "Pure DPS" classes and "Hybrid Classes". I personally think DPS warriors are too OP as is given their optimal for tank, and that they should get their damage output nerfed somehow. I think multi function classes should be viable for damage, but not nessecarily equal to pure dps classes. All things the same (Gear, Consules, Competency), I think Hybrid classes should ~85-90% the damage output. Putting a great Ele shaman or a great feral druid at about the damage output as an OK mage. But a great mage will still come out on top. At this damage level though, no reason to avoid them in the raids. Ideally, The gearing changes are not ment to make all classes even, and not even more powerfull, just make all specs viable for both leveling, raiding, and pvp. I think gear itemization alone can mostly accomplish that.
I personally would like to see this done ~3 months after NAX release. This means no new content, NAX is still the ultimate end goal, which gives people more time to get through the content, but at the same time, it introduces 'new content' and reasons to level up alts, roll new specs, etc. Essentially its an easy way to work towrds better balance.
I'm definitely in the separate servers camp. I'd be interested in both TBC and WotLK personally. I've often wondered why Blizzard is so keen to let everyone see the raid content via LFR etc when they regularly invalidate all old content with new expansions. I'd like to be able to play whichever expansion I like as they are all essentially different games. That said, I don't find it particularly feasible to split it further.
I would likely also be more interested in Classic+ over new retail expansions.
Likes: 45
The Burning Crusade is nostalgia and not what we need. Sit in Shattrah with the enemy faction. Dead rivalry. Stuck on a 7 zone continent you can fly over in a few minutes. Many forgettable zones. We got Nagrand again in WoD? Did anyone care, no. Draenor was Outland. Earn raid gear that is mostly useless in PvP. Resilience. Arena is rampant with restodruid/sl lock cancer. All the meta comps are known. Eye of the storm, god no. Dungeons that split into 4 wings ,and visually blend together. Dungeon boss fights and gear drops that few remember. Badge gear. Daily quests on a single island that replace farming in the world. Dranei. Nobody cares about them. Blood elves do not belong on the Horde whatsoever. Horde Paladins and Alliance Shaman. Dead lore. They eviscerated the WC3 story, turning the main characters into whiney loot pinatas.
WoTLK is even worse. Wotlk is like a totally different MMO altogether. The expansions ruined WoW due to Blizzard's shortsightedness. Blizzard felt they wielded the power to redesign the genre. Instead they destroyed it. The real solution is to follow the path that Cataclysm took. Add new zones to Azeroth. Add new races and starting areas. Add challenging 5 man dungeon content. Add new Raids. Add a seasonal ranking system for World PvP and PvE. You need vertical progression to some extent.
TBC or fresh new original content? Oldschool Runescape actually created brand new content specifically for their Oldschool iteration and have found success in doing so. I'm one to believe that branching off into an original, novel path will bring unexpected success. Of course, I would expect whatever they do moving forward to be on their own servers to keep the WoW Classic experience isolated.
Add my vote for TBC+. I loved TBC but there was a lot it did wrong: flying mounts, invalidating Naxx gear with greens, the token system, Horde paladins and Alliance shamans, etc. It would take a lot of work to fix these things but unlike Classic+ they won't be starting from nothing.
Pipe dreams aside I believe they'll either do regular TBC as a safe choice or no expansion at all and try to funnel people over to retail. I've heard rumors that they aren't keen on having two MMOs with two dev teams, and many TBC fans won't agree that my above list needs to be fixed. Between the two MMOs retail stands to get them more profit from all the scummy MTX it's packing; suits at Activision will smell the money and ignore the passion, as they always do.
Yeah, Activision Blizzard is going to do what makes them the most money. And just rolling out old expansions in succession or trying to funnel people back onto a single MMO platform is probably the path of least resistance for them.Lendryn wrote: ↑5 years agoPipe dreams aside I believe they'll either do regular TBC as a safe choice or no expansion at all and try to funnel people over to retail. I've heard rumors that they aren't keen on having two MMOs with two dev teams, and many TBC fans won't agree that my above list needs to be fixed. Between the two MMOs retail stands to get them more profit from all the scummy MTX it's packing; suits at Activision will smell the money and ignore the passion, as they always do.
But I'm not going to argue for what I want based on what makes them the most profit. They can worry about that themselves. I think the best we can do as a community is keep talking about what we want, see if we can find any common pillars, and then advocate for them to head in that direction.
TBC makes business sense and will be where they go next. The content is already made. They just need to hire a skeleton crew as a restoration team to bring it back to life. Small financial investment with a massive return (just like Classic!). This has always been the obvious route Blizz would take. This does not mean that Classic will be forced into BC... The entire purpose of Classic is that it is timelocked. It would make no sense to invest into Classic and only allow it to play through one cycle when they know they can harvest it repeatedly. I'm not sure why people assume that Blizz would force your character into TBC... This would make no business sense.
Of course this also wont exclude Classic+ content. I see Classic going a full cycle and then Blizz releasing TBC with the option to transfer a character. Sometime after this I could see them allowing you to transfer other characters for money. Otherwise your Classic characters are stuck on Classic. I could then see them introducing Classic+ content if the game is still active, fresh Classic servers OR simply merging dying servers to keep Classic alive for an extended period. Of course the outcome for Classic will depend entirely on the revenue they can create with the product longterm. I highly doubt THEY have a definitive plan for Classic and I think they will make the choice as time goes on. If the product remains succesful, they will invest into a profitable asset! If the product begins to lose valuable, it will not be valuable and they will remove resources from the asset and harvest it for as long as can be sustained.
As far as people doubting the success of BC, you are the exact same as people who doubted Classic. BC has a massive following in its own right. Based on the pserver interest I could see Classic, BC and WoTLK succeeding in the Classic atmosphere. Restoring the trilogy makes sense AND people who are uninterested in the products individually would likely be interested in playing through the story lines as they happened, if they could access all 3 in a row. While I'm sure many tourists wont stay for an extended period in Classic, I could see a lot of appeal for playing through Vanilla, transferring to BC and playing through BC and then finishing in WoTLK to have an authentic experience. This would be the endgame for a tourist.
2000 IQg0bledyg00k wrote: ↑5 years agoNever making a single investment again until I 100% know it pays off.
Likes: 45
You think you do, but you don't. TBC and WOTLK are so overrated. I almost want Blizzard to release them and watch their population crater. It would vindicate Classic once and for all.Stfuppercut wrote: ↑5 years agoTBC makes business sense and will be where they go next. The content is already made. They just need to hire a skeleton crew as a restoration team to bring it back to life. Small financial investment with a massive return (just like Classic!). This has always been the obvious route Blizz would take. This does not mean that Classic will be forced into BC... The entire purpose of Classic is that it is timelocked. It would make no sense to invest into Classic and only allow it to play through one cycle when they know they can harvest it repeatedly. I'm not sure why people assume that Blizz would force your character into TBC... This would make no business sense.
Of course this also wont exclude Classic+ content. I see Classic going a full cycle and then Blizz releasing TBC with the option to transfer a character. Sometime after this I could see them allowing you to transfer other characters for money. Otherwise your Classic characters are stuck on Classic. I could then see them introducing Classic+ content if the game is still active, fresh Classic servers OR simply merging dying servers to keep Classic alive for an extended period. Of course the outcome for Classic will depend entirely on the revenue they can create with the product longterm. I highly doubt THEY have a definitive plan for Classic and I think they will make the choice as time goes on. If the product remains succesful, they will invest into a profitable asset! If the product begins to lose valuable, it will not be valuable and they will remove resources from the asset and harvest it for as long as can be sustained.
As far as people doubting the success of BC, you are the exact same as people who doubted Classic. BC has a massive following in its own right. Based on the pserver interest I could see Classic, BC and WoTLK succeeding in the Classic atmosphere. Restoring the trilogy makes sense AND people who are uninterested in the products individually would likely be interested in playing through the story lines as they happened, if they could access all 3 in a row. While I'm sure many tourists wont stay for an extended period in Classic, I could see a lot of appeal for playing through Vanilla, transferring to BC and playing through BC and then finishing in WoTLK to have an authentic experience. This would be the endgame for a tourist.
Weak. Your trolling has become lazy. Go make me a new post about one of your terrible PvP ideas to keep me busy for 4 days.RedridgeGnoll wrote: ↑5 years agoYou think you do, but you don't. TBC and WOTLK are so overrated. I almost want Blizzard to release them and watch their population crater. It would vindicate Classic once and for all.
2000 IQg0bledyg00k wrote: ↑5 years agoNever making a single investment again until I 100% know it pays off.
Likes: 45
What is so good about WOTLK?Stfuppercut wrote: ↑5 years agoWeak. Your trolling has become lazy. Go make me a new post about one of your terrible PvP ideas to keep me busy for 4 days.RedridgeGnoll wrote: ↑5 years agoYou think you do, but you don't. TBC and WOTLK are so overrated. I almost want Blizzard to release them and watch their population crater. It would vindicate Classic once and for all.
Terrible 5 mans. Imbalanced Deathknight class. Stuck on a 7 continent zone. 310% Flying mounts to skip over Northrend. Horde+Alliance crammed in Dalaran. Dumbed down Naxxramas. Argent tournament, ruby sanctum awful. Garbage world pvp zone Wintergrasp. Terrible BGs Isle of Conquest and Strand of Ancients. Vehicle PvP idiotic. Ridiculous op specs like Ret Paladins in pvp. Endless daily quests. Dungeon Finder.. and more
What was so great? Grizzly Hills? Fighting Arthas? Doing Ulduar once a week?
That is nostalgia talking. Unless maybe you enjoying loitering in dalaran sewer all day with rats.
Classic Plus is fun to think about, but unfortunately, it destroys the whole point of Classic. if Classic Plus were to be implemented, people would immediately start screaming for "Classic Minus". Expansion servers are the only reasonable way forward.
Actually, there is as much demand for MoP servers as there is for Classic and BC, and only slightly less for Cat. The most popular by far is Wrath.
Yes they do. A Blood Elf is literally warchief right now.
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Likes: 45
What kind of nonsense is this?Black Monarch wrote: ↑5 years agoActually, there is as much demand for MoP servers as there is for Classic and BC, and only slightly less for Cat. The most popular by far is Wrath.
This. I had never actually thought of it as a trilogy but it actually makes a lot of sense. Solid ending as well. I really enjoyed getting the first kill on the Lich King, it felt like a proper ending.Stfuppercut wrote: ↑5 years agoAs far as people doubting the success of BC, you are the exact same as people who doubted Classic. BC has a massive following in its own right. Based on the pserver interest I could see Classic, BC and WoTLK succeeding in the Classic atmosphere. Restoring the trilogy makes sense AND people who are uninterested in the products individually would likely be interested in playing through the story lines as they happened, if they could access all 3 in a row. While I'm sure many tourists wont stay for an extended period in Classic, I could see a lot of appeal for playing through Vanilla, transferring to BC and playing through BC and then finishing in WoTLK to have an authentic experience. This would be the endgame for a tourist.
I'd love to see Classic seasons rolled out, kind of like what they do now on Diablo 3. All the current servers would stay alive, but once all 6 content phases are released, + a period of time, they could stand up new seasonal servers. And those seasonal servers could cycle through a period of time, then close, then re-open again. There is definitely a progression crowd that this would cater to, would be minimal effort on the part of Blizzard, and seems fun.Stfuppercut wrote: ↑5 years agoTBC makes business sense and will be where they go next. The content is already made. They just need to hire a skeleton crew as a restoration team to bring it back to life. Small financial investment with a massive return (just like Classic!). This has always been the obvious route Blizz would take. This does not mean that Classic will be forced into BC... The entire purpose of Classic is that it is timelocked. It would make no sense to invest into Classic and only allow it to play through one cycle when they know they can harvest it repeatedly. I'm not sure why people assume that Blizz would force your character into TBC... This would make no business sense.
From the mouth of the beast itself:Stfuppercut wrote: ↑5 years agoI highly doubt THEY have a definitive plan for Classic and I think they will make the choice as time goes on. If the product remains succesful, they will invest into a profitable asset! If the product begins to lose valuable, it will not be valuable and they will remove resources from the asset and harvest it for as long as can be sustained.
> What are the plans after Phase 6? More content for classic or moving to TBC?
They're looking for feedback on where we want to go next. They need time to develop their software roadmap, so they're going to start doing that soon. And since now is the feedback period, the question is what do we all want? Are there core things in common between all of us that stand out?
We've done most of the hard work by bringing back 1.12 so progressing to Burning Crusade would be a lot easier for us. Our plan is to identify everything we need to do should we ever decide to go this route. We want to be sensitive to the desires of our players. Some may want BC and some may not. We'll be following the Classic community closely to help determine what our next steps should be.
I'm not against TBC or Wrath servers. I would at least play an alt on TBC, not sure about Wrath. But still not against it. But these would have the same snapshot issue that Classic suffers from. TBC and Wrath weren't single patch fixed assets, just like how the original game wasn't. But with the Classic model, we're frozen in time with a single talent point, spec, and itemization(largely) patch that lives throughout the entirety of the game. These games were all alive and changed and morphed as time went on, and having everything locked in place isn't quite the same experience.
That's why I do want a Classic+ model. And to me that means no new features, no new in-game systems. No new races or classes, and no merging of all classes to allow everybody to do everything like they can on retail. What I would want in a Classic+ is for some specs to get boosted to viability, like Prot Paladins, Ret Paladins, OOMKins, etc. But not in a way to nerf the game content, or add new capabilities.. just make them suck less in comparison to the other classes. And I'd want to see new zones and raids, but would keep the level cap at level 60. I'd be fine with adding progression beyond Naxx, making the existing raids more difficult, and adding more 10 and 20 man raids for players to do after UBRS and AQ20 that don't need to be in a guild to pull off. I think adding things like this to the Classic framework fits within the philosophies of the original game and don't try to change what the original game was could work.
So I guess this is my own priority list of what I want to see a couple years from now, after we've all had time to settle in and enjoy Classic for a long time:
1> Classic+ with an OSRS development model run by community supermajority voting
2> Seasonal servers added to current classic
3> TBC followed by Wrath servers
Any of these are fine, but an eventual Classic+ is my preference.
I cant speak for the people who like WoTLK as it is my least favorite xpac. But there is a ton of interest for it (as shown by the private community seeking to play it). Just as Cata is often reminisced about in the high-end PvP community for its balance and competitive nature. Just as MoP is held dear to those who started post WoTLK. Each audience will be interested in their version of the game, just as you are interested in your own version of the game that does not appeal to the rest of us. The trick for Blizz is to assess the interest in individual xpacs and get some raw data on what their projected return would look like. Separating all of the noise from facts and investing in winning games.
I can only speak for myself. I will play Classic a lot. If/when BC comes out, I will play it a lot. If/when WoTLK comes out, I will play it casually. After this I personally would not play a Classic project.
2000 IQg0bledyg00k wrote: ↑5 years agoNever making a single investment again until I 100% know it pays off.
