So let's say, for pure purposes pvp, that you gotta choose between:
-human warrior: you get paladins for the insane utility they give you in pvp with freedom, cleanse and so on, and you get perception against rogues and druids (yeah gnome and dwarf are better but I wanna top dps meters in pve, so human it is)
-orc warrior: op stun resist plus windfury totem
Imo, and I'd like to know what you think about this: orcs are waaaaaay better than humans in pvp, but paladins are a much, much better support for warrios in pvp: they enable warriors several times more.
So it sounds like this is a case of "orc warrior is better for 1v1 or random wpvp encounters", but "alliance warriors have a much easier time in group pvp thanks to paladins".
Is it a good sum up?
If you are talking race by race, sure Orc with the stun resist is amazing/better especially 1v1 but stun resist against a warlock and caster dont mean much. Yeah they have impact and blackout but not always, its a 5/5 talent. And 30% is alot but there is a chance you dont resist anything which does that make you worst than a Human...I doubt it but maybe but its about how skillful you are and how skillful your opponent is...
I guess you can say humans are better with paladins versus orcs with shamans but honestly how good are you with a paladin that doesnt use their utility spells or healing? What I am trying to say is in a group setting your only as good as the your surrounding cast. Same goes for 1v1 situations because not everyone is elite level pvpers or elite at the game in general. So play what you like versus which is better, I think this is what we are heading towards.
| Nýxt - Demonology Warlock | Kirtonos PVP | Level 50 | - | Awkaran - Resto Druid | Kirtonos PVP | Level 20 |
| Fatherbatch - Holy Priest | Kirtonos PVP | Level 1 | - | Reignmaker - Frost Mage | Kirtonos PVP | Level 1 |
Honestly... it's such a hard call to make. Because yes, paladins are damn good and freedom is crazy good. But you know what counters freedom? Purge and frost shock. Freedom has a cooldown where purge doesn't.
Again, it's such a hard call because it's all based on situations. But personally, seeing those sexy whirlwinds from a windfury proc is just so damn... ungggg
But the survivability of a paladin is crazy. Having 12 seconds of uninterrupted healing thanks to divine shield can 100% save/turn a fight. BUT a shaman can pretty quickly delete people as well with a 30/0/21 build, so again, it's really hard to say.
But I know historically alliance premades beat out horde premades and horde pugs beat out alliance pugs.
Agreed. Imo if you have a guild and you're going for the endgame content, alliance is overall easier and better. Paladins are that game changing, it's insane (dwarf priests are great with fear ward and desperate prayer too)Justbe wrote: ↑5 years agoHonestly... it's such a hard call to make. Because yes, paladins are damn good and freedom is crazy good. But you know what counters freedom? Purge and frost shock. Freedom has a cooldown where purge doesn't.
Again, it's such a hard call because it's all based on situations. But personally, seeing those sexy whirlwinds from a windfury proc is just so damn... ungggg
But the survivability of a paladin is crazy. Having 12 seconds of uninterrupted healing thanks to divine shield can 100% save/turn a fight. BUT a shaman can pretty quickly delete people as well with a 30/0/21 build, so again, it's really hard to say.
But I know historically alliance premades beat out horde premades and horde pugs beat out alliance pugs.
-grenades (every pvper uses them)Nyxt wrote: ↑5 years agoIf you are talking race by race, sure Orc with the stun resist is amazing/better especially 1v1 but stun resist against a warlock and caster dont mean much. Yeah they have impact and blackout but not always, its a 5/5 talent. And 30% is alot but there is a chance you dont resist anything which does that make you worst than a Human...I doubt it but maybe but its about how skillful you are and how skillful your opponent is...
I guess you can say humans are better with paladins versus orcs with shamans but honestly how good are you with a paladin that doesnt use their utility spells or healing? What I am trying to say is in a group setting your only as good as the your surrounding cast. Same goes for 1v1 situations because not everyone is elite level pvpers or elite at the game in general. So play what you like versus which is better, I think this is what we are heading towards.
-tidal wave,
-intimidation, stun proc from hunter's slow
-rogue stuns,
-mage's impact,
-shadow priest's blackout
-druid 's bear form stun, cat stun (pounce)
-warrior's stuns (charge and intercept),
-paladin's 6 second stun and the seal that stuns
stuns are literally everywhere in pvp
Okay, I wasn't arguing that, of course stuns are everywhere but not all mages and all priests in pvp specs into impact or black out.Raiken wrote: ↑5 years ago-grenades (every pvper uses them)Nyxt wrote: ↑5 years agoIf you are talking race by race, sure Orc with the stun resist is amazing/better especially 1v1 but stun resist against a warlock and caster dont mean much. Yeah they have impact and blackout but not always, its a 5/5 talent. And 30% is alot but there is a chance you dont resist anything which does that make you worst than a Human...I doubt it but maybe but its about how skillful you are and how skillful your opponent is...
I guess you can say humans are better with paladins versus orcs with shamans but honestly how good are you with a paladin that doesnt use their utility spells or healing? What I am trying to say is in a group setting your only as good as the your surrounding cast. Same goes for 1v1 situations because not everyone is elite level pvpers or elite at the game in general. So play what you like versus which is better, I think this is what we are heading towards.
-tidal wave,
-intimidation, stun proc from hunter's slow
-rogue stuns,
-mage's impact,
-shadow priest's blackout
-druid 's bear form stun, cat stun (pounce)
-warrior's stuns (charge and intercept),
-paladin's 6 second stun and the seal that stuns
stuns are literally everywhere in pvp
Dont recall warlock with a stun. So as I was saying stun resist against a priest(no blackout), mage(no impact) or warlock 1v1 dont matter.
If they are engineering sure but not all pvpers are and werent back then. My point I was making is not every person/group you face are the best of the best especially in Vanilla where arenas dont exist that queue you up with the same skill level (rating).
So, if in your original post, the example may be true, if we are assuming if everyone is at the same skill level.
But we all know this will not be the case...
| Nýxt - Demonology Warlock | Kirtonos PVP | Level 50 | - | Awkaran - Resto Druid | Kirtonos PVP | Level 20 |
| Fatherbatch - Holy Priest | Kirtonos PVP | Level 1 | - | Reignmaker - Frost Mage | Kirtonos PVP | Level 1 |
They don't get a base stun, but if they spec into destruction and put 2 points into Pyroclasm you get a 26% chance to stun targets when you use Rain of Fire, Hellfire, and Soulfire. If you also put 5 points into Aftermath (also in the destruction tree) you get a 10% chance to Daze targets with any destruction spell.
Definitely not as scary as say a druids bash which is a 100% chance to stun (unless of course it's resisted, parried, or blocked).
I miss the third (and for PvP, best) option: Tauren for the insane added melee range. War Stomp is really good as well. Don't like Rogues dodging your Mortal Strikes? He too good to let you Intercept him? Just War Stomp and Mortal Strike :D pro tip: in a tight group fight if you have enough Rage pop Sweeping Strikes + Whirlwind right after War Stomping. No dodges or parries guarantees big damage!
The added melee range is really insane, especially for Warriors. Because Warriors don't just want to hit 1 target in front of them, they want to hit all targets around them (Whirlwind). The added range basically increases the area in which your WW can hit targets by 96%!
96% because: normal melee hitbox = 5 yards, Tauren male melee hitbox = 7 yards.
Surface area of normal melee range = 2*pi*5^2 = 78.54.
Surface area of Tauren melee range = 2*pi*7^2 = 153.94.
153.94 / 78.54 = 1.96.
