Silverpine Forest
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1 year ago (Beta)
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Each player holds, at minimum, 16 pieces of functional gear (i.e., not shirts or tabards).

Therefore, outfitting a 40-man raid group with 100% Molten Core gear will require 640 pieces of Molten Core gear.

Each boss drops 2 pieces of gear, so they'll need 320 boss kills.

Molten core has 10 bosses. Therefore, they'll need 32 runs.

You can only run MC once per week. Therefore, even if a 40-man raid group succeeds in clearing Molten Core in the very first week of phase 1 and every single week thereafter, and absolutely no redundant or wrong-faction gear drops for them, it will take them 32 weeks, at a minimum, to acquire every piece of gear that they could possibly want from MC, not counting legendaries.

32 weeks is like... 7 or 8 months. Throw in RNG, and your average group of people who actually have lives outside of WoW will probably take more than a year.

Therefore, I recommend that Phase 3 and BWL not unlock until at least a year from now.

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Ashenvale
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1 year ago (Beta)
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Yeah. Due to raid lockout timers, running them once a week, it takes a while for a full raid to get geared. This is also why guilds tend to care about bringing serious people with them into raids until they have the thing on farm, so they don't waste loot on people who aren't going to help out in the long haul.

At the same time, you don't need for all 40 players to have 16 pieces of MC gear before you move on to BWL. You want to have a good amount of it, but you don't need 640 pieces of MC gear before you can start off on the next step. In fact I wager that no guild is getting 640 pieces of MC gear before moving on to BWL, and same goes with BWL loot. A lot of people get alot of BWL loot, and then you start mixing in the other raids as well.

BWL unlocking a year away is way too far out. I think most people in progression guilds would complain about it taking 6 months for BWL to appear.

   Grindhouse
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Black Monarch wrote:
1 year ago
Therefore, outfitting a 40-man raid group with 100% Molten Core gear will require 640 pieces of Molten Core gear.
Gonna stop you riiiiiight there. For many classes - they wont need much from MC.

http://www.wowclassicbis.com/

Take a look at warriors after MC. Weapons from Ony/MC. Otherwise 4 raid drops. Wearing 9 pieces of gear from outside of raid.

Warlocks? 8 raid drops... Keeping in mind that some of these will be VERY sought after, so many will go late late into the game without getting these pieces.

Holy pallies have 7-8 raid drops?

Keep in mind this is BEST IN SLOT for this tier... You dont NEED to have this gear. This is the BEST case circumstance for these specs... Due to RNG, you wont see every person equipped in this gear and getting this gear shouldnt dictate the pacing of the game because players will be bored with the content LOOOOOOOONG before they have collected everything they need, despite how few items they actually need.

You wont need 640 pieces from MC to gear your team. Lets face it Classic will be a lot easier than Private and we had less time to gear on private, less debuff slots, bosses had more armor, the loot we were getting had progressive itemization (meaning it was WORSE than the gear you will get in Classic) and the content was still trivial on a double release schedule. If anything layering has a chance to extend the time you have to gear up in phase 1/2 by a great deal, even though many classes/specs dont need much from MC at all.

Add the fact that many guilds on private easily progressed through BWL with many members still wearing a significant portion of pre BiS due to the quick release cycle and....... ....... Well... Extending these phases is a recipe for boredom.

Most classes get very little from MC and the ones who do are usually only getting marginal upgrades from their BiS. Tuning a release schedule based around the FULL collection of gear is a TERRIBLE idea. It extends a phase that has very limited content for players who have very little to collect which only serves to have the playerbase VERY geared when headed into the next phase, which then trivializes the new content even further than it already is (because everyone is COMPLETELY geared from phase 1/2 when entering BWL). Bad ideas all around.

   Pluuf
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1 year ago (Beta)
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While I completely agree with @Stfuppercut on the statement I would like to add: wouldn't it take out all the challenge if every guild was fully outfitted in Tier1/MC levels of gear when stepping into BWL? I think it would only be more fun if people start in these later raids when they're not fully decked in those purples and maybe have a quest item or two remaining.

Where's the challenge otherwise?

   Stfuppercut
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Let's release all the raids backwards. Naxx first, nobody can clear it. The raids keep getting easier from there. AQ40, AQ20. Things are still difficult in blue gear from UBRS, still no clears. BWL is around the corner. The race is on. Who is first to clear as the content gets progressively easier until somebody finally breaks through with a clear in all-blue dungeon gear? All the content is there, just taunting people. :lol:

   Pluuf Vlostek Saltybob Grindhouse
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Pippina wrote:
1 year ago
Let's release all the raids backwards. Naxx first, nobody can clear it. The raids keep getting easier from there. AQ40, AQ20. Things are still difficult in blue gear from UBRS, still no clears. BWL is around the corner. The race is on. Who is first to clear as the content gets progressively easier until somebody finally breaks through with a clear in all-blue dungeon gear? All the content is there, just taunting people. :lol:
Slow down there Satan!

   Selexin daisyKutter Pippina
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1 year ago (Beta)
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I mean, that’s not how it works really. You don’t need all slots pimped out with MC gear to progress to the next raid. You can do that, but it will take forever. Take into account that a raiding guild will have more than 40 people wanting to raid or that you might lose some members with gear and gain new ones with no gear and you can spend your entire classic experience trying to gear up from MC.

Also don’t forget phase 1 will also have Onyxia’s Lair. I knew many people that had their T2 helm way before their T1.

Silverpine Forest
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People will at least want to complete their tier sets so that they can spend some time not looking like clowns

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Black Monarch wrote:
1 year ago
People will at least want to complete their tier sets so that they can spend some time not looking like clowns
It never worked like that. Prepare to go into Naxx wearing some T1, some T2 and some AQ items (also, a couple blue items). :wink:
Also, if you get T2 piece set before T1, don't expect to get this T1 item as there will be people needing it before you.

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I just want my https://classic.wowhead.com/item=17103/ ... e#comments from MC and I'll be happy.

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1 year ago (Beta)
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The only one that needs gear from MC is tanks more or less, there alot of great gear outside of the raiding. Especially in ph 1-2

Paladin Protection
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You'll only feel that dry spot for a little while. Then out of no where you will start getting epics left and right that you don't know what to do with.
Everyone's pre-bis is up to BWL standard. There isn't much MC gear that will replace it other than the obvious handful of pieces. IE: If you see a class wearing full T1 in bwl they're doing something wrong unless its for a very specific thing...(Like T1 paladin swinging nightfall and keeping judges up).

Here's my one year mark near the end of AQ patch before server died. (Fresh killed it) and I was a prot paladin during this so I wasn't getting much. a lot of other mainspec classes were disenchanting gear to make room.


You'll eventually start disenchanting a good chunk of the drops in raids. By the time you're raiding AQ40 you'll be DEing almost everything in MC and more than half of the stuff in BWL.

Like even as a prot paladin during phase one I think the only thing I need from MC is the tank ring and the shield but I mostly only care for the ring.

All in all you'll get loot tossed at you that you didn't even ask for. People will be passing up gear and have "no you have...No you take it" back and forths.

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1 year ago (Beta)
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Black Monarch wrote:
1 year ago
Each player holds, at minimum, 16 pieces of functional gear (i.e., not shirts or tabards).

Therefore, outfitting a 40-man raid group with 100% Molten Core gear will require 640 pieces of Molten Core gear.

Each boss drops 2 pieces of gear, so they'll need 320 boss kills.

Molten core has 10 bosses. Therefore, they'll need 32 runs.

You can only run MC once per week. Therefore, even if a 40-man raid group succeeds in clearing Molten Core in the very first week of phase 1 and every single week thereafter, and absolutely no redundant or wrong-faction gear drops for them, it will take them 32 weeks, at a minimum, to acquire every piece of gear that they could possibly want from MC, not counting legendaries.

32 weeks is like... 7 or 8 months. Throw in RNG, and your average group of people who actually have lives outside of WoW will probably take more than a year.

Therefore, I recommend that Phase 3 and BWL not unlock until at least a year from now.
I agree. I do wish however they release bgs in sooner phases.

Felwood
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1 year ago (Beta)
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Relik wrote:
1 year ago
I just want my https://classic.wowhead.com/item=17103/ ... e#comments from MC and I'll be happy.
You will be competing against 10 other casters for that ;)

   Relik
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As a Shaman I probably won't need all items from MC, however it would be cool to get the whole set at least!

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The complication is that there are some slots that will not be filled by MC gear for some classes/specs. Additionally, T1 for some classes is hot trash. I think Paladins, for instance, are better off using off-set gear for Holy than T1 in most slots. Likely the same for others.

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Kazukii wrote:
1 year ago
Relik wrote:
1 year ago
I just want my https://classic.wowhead.com/item=17103/ ... e#comments from MC and I'll be happy.
You will be competing against 10 other casters for that ;)
I'm just hoping they blow their DKP on the first purples they see whilst I wait patiently in the shadows. :twisted:

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Relik wrote:
1 year ago
Kazukii wrote:
1 year ago
Relik wrote:
1 year ago
I just want my https://classic.wowhead.com/item=17103/ ... e#comments from MC and I'll be happy.
You will be competing against 10 other casters for that ;)
I'm just hoping they blow their DKP on the first purples they see whilst I wait patiently in the shadows. :twisted:
they will.

   Relik
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