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This is a feature that could be added to Classic WoW later on. I think that World PvP in Classic WoW could use some improvements. This battle for resources concept is inspired by Warcraft 3. The contested territory in Azeroth would essentially have resources that both factions would fight over. The battles would rotate between each of the contested zones, and last about an hour or so. The purpose would be to earn bonus honor by helping your faction stockpile gold, lumber, and food. The more resources a player contributes to their faction's total, the more bonus honor they receive at the end of the battle.

There would be Gold, Lumber, and Food nodes that spawn across a zone during the battle. If killed in the zone while a battle was taking place, the player would drop any resources they had collected. Players would need to gather 25 of a resource in order to contribute to their faction's score. The 25 resources would be removed from their inventory, and added to the resource score. An example would be as follows:

Battle Zone:Winterspring (Ends when one faction caps each resource)

Horde:

  • 0/1000 Gold
  • 0/1000 Food
  • 0/1000 Lumber

Alliance:
  • 0/1000 Gold
  • 0/1000 Food
  • 0/1000 Lumber

A serverwide message would announce that Winterspring is the new battle zone. Gold, Lumber, and Food resources would spawn in Winterspring. Players would roam the zone looting these resources. Once you collect 25 Gold, Lumber, or Food, it would be taken from your inventory and added to your faction's resource score. So you loot 20 lumber, then kill a player and loot 10 lumber off of that player. You contribute 25 lumber to the resource score, and get left with 5 in your inventory. Once you have secured resources for your faction, you would be eligble for bonus honor.

The more resources that a player turns in, the more Honor they receive when the battle ends. Players would earn 100 honor per resource they turn in. If a player contributes 30 lumber, 15 gold, and 20 food to their faction's total, they would earn (30x100) + (15x100) + (20x100) = 6,500 honor. When one faction reaches the Gold, Lumber, and Food caps, they will be declared the winner of the battle. The winning faction will receive an honor and experience buff in the zone for a set amount of time. When the Winterspring battle ends, a new zone will be designated as a battle zone and the resource caps will be reset.

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Sounds a lot like the old Warhammer MMO to me. That failed miserably. You're about 11 years too late on this one. They would flag up specific PvP zones to help win control for your faction. Winning an area would increase your resources and overall control. Players could also contribute by doing PvP PQ's (public quests) in an open world format. These quests were usually related to resource gathering which would then accumulate victory points... Killing players of the opposite faction would allow you to take their stuff as well. Most people just didn't give a shit and decided to do battlegrounds instead. The same thing would happen with WoW.

You're looking for a new MMO my man. From your post history, it sounds like Classic is not for you.

Warhammer:
"Each activity generated Victory Points (VP) which measured a realm's progress in capturing a zone. When one realm reached a designated number of Victory Points in a particular zone, that zone fell under their control and the war pushed deeper into enemy territory. This back and forth struggle for zone control would continue until one side held two racial pairings, and the attacking side may sack, loot, and pillage the enemy's capital city. The capture of a capital city was the objective of the campaign. Once a capital city was taken, the attackers were given a period time to loot the city. When this period expired, the defeated players received increasing support from NPC guards until they were able to force the attackers out of their city and close the gates. At this point the campaign would then begun anew, restarting the cycle. "
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warhammer ... _Reckoning

Sounded awesome. Was fun to begin with. Died CRAZY fast... The idea didn't work.

Blizzard also tried to implement this with PvP zones several different times. The first time was with those towers in Burning Crusade. You would fight for control of them and then get an honor bonus and some sort of tokens to spend on gear. I believe the later towers in BC actually gave zone-wide buffs? They tried several times to revitalize the idea and implement it in a different way, and each time it failed horribly. Fighting for zone control in random PvP events does not work in WoW. This is not a new idea... This is a very very old idea that has failed repeatedly for Blizz.

edit: want to know how this idea would end? Either no one would do it. OR if it offered the highest honor per hour, players would do it and would run right by eachother collecting resources as quickly as possible. The odd person would try to PvP. They would get killed swiftly by packs of geared PvE'rs who were farming this to get their honor. Would be the exact same as AV trains that ride right beside eachother. Any PvP idea that involves gaining honor without forcing players to fight and kill one another, is a TERRIBLE idea.

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:eek:

You really don't like the idea of Classic WoW do you @RedridgeGnoll? Hahaha :lol:

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Stfuppercut wrote:
3 months ago
Sounds a lot like the old Warhammer MMO to me. That failed miserably. You're about 11 years too late on this one. They would flag up specific PvP zones to help win control for your faction. Winning an area would increase your resources and overall control. Players could also contribute by doing PvP PQ's (public quests) in an open world format. These quests were usually related to resource gathering which would then accumulate victory points... Killing players of the opposite faction would allow you to take their stuff as well. Most people just didn't give a shit and decided to do battlegrounds instead. The same thing would happen with WoW.

You're looking for a new MMO my man. From your post history, it sounds like Classic is not for you.

Warhammer:
"Each activity generated Victory Points (VP) which measured a realm's progress in capturing a zone. When one realm reached a designated number of Victory Points in a particular zone, that zone fell under their control and the war pushed deeper into enemy territory. This back and forth struggle for zone control would continue until one side held two racial pairings, and the attacking side may sack, loot, and pillage the enemy's capital city. The capture of a capital city was the objective of the campaign. Once a capital city was taken, the attackers were given a period time to loot the city. When this period expired, the defeated players received increasing support from NPC guards until they were able to force the attackers out of their city and close the gates. At this point the campaign would then begun anew, restarting the cycle. "
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warhammer ... _Reckoning

Sounded awesome. Was fun to begin with. Died CRAZY fast... The idea didn't work.

Blizzard also tried to implement this with PvP zones several different times. The first time was with those towers in Burning Crusade. You would fight for control of them and then get an honor bonus and some sort of tokens to spend on gear. I believe the later towers in BC actually gave zone-wide buffs? They tried several times to revitalize the idea and implement it in a different way, and each time it failed horribly. Fighting for zone control in random PvP events does not work in WoW. This is not a new idea... This is a very very old idea that has failed repeatedly for Blizz.

edit: want to know how this idea would end? Either no one would do it. OR if it offered the highest honor per hour, players would do it and would run right by eachother collecting resources as quickly as possible. The odd person would try to PvP. They would get killed swiftly by packs of geared PvE'rs who were farming this to get their honor. Would be the exact same as AV trains that ride right beside eachother. Any PvP idea that involves gaining honor without forcing players to fight and kill one another, is a TERRIBLE idea.
I appreciate your prompt response. By the way, I was there launch night of Warhammer Online. The Warhammer Online campaigns aren't exactly the same thing as this Battlezone concept. The battlegrounds in Warhammer gave such lopsided rewards, so players only focused on doing bgs. The Zone Capture stuff was also really bugged and confusing. I agree it was a total failure.

The idea is to make this an alternative to honor farming in the battlegrounds all day. It would offer individual rewards, not just a faction-wide ones. The resource nodes would be spread out across the map of the designated zone, and you would still be at risk while turning them in. If you see another player roaming around gathering resources, you would have incentive to kill them, because they might be carrying a lot resources. Why would players roam in a pack, when only one player could loot the resource nodes. You would be incentivized to split up in smaller groups or even solo to keep more resources for yourself. The more resources you contribute, the more honor you earn. It is a simple mechanic that has major benefits. If there is too much competition or players in the zone, then that means that it's probably appealing.

One thing I am unsure about is the Turn-in NPCs. Do you just make an Alliance and Horde NPC that is protected by guards? What about enemy players camping the turn-in NPC or the routes? The stuff that Blizzard added was like Tower captures in EPL and Hellfire Peninsula. The reward was like a zone-wide buff. Collecting Gold, Lumber, and Food across an entire zone would give players honor in return. The system is much different than what Blizzard created.

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RedridgeGnoll wrote:
3 months ago
The Warhammer Online campaigns aren't exactly the same thing as this Battlezone concept. The battlegrounds in Warhammer gave such lopsided rewards, so players only focused on doing bgs. The Zone Capture stuff was also really bugged and confusing. I agree it was a total failure.

The idea is to make it an alternative to honor farming in the battlegrounds all day. It wouldn't necessarily be active 24/7. The resource nodes would be spread out across the map of the designated zone, and you would still be at risk while turning them in. If you see another player roaming around gathering resources, you would have incentive to kill them, because they might be carrying a lot. Why would players roam in a pack, when only one player could loot the resource nodes. You would be incentivized to split up in smaller groups or even solo to keep more resources for yourself. The more resources you contribute, the more honor you earn. It is a simple mechanic that has major benefits. If there is too much competition or players in the zone, then that means that it's probably appealing.

The stuff that Blizzard added was like Tower captuires in EPL and Hellfire Peninsula. The reward was like a zone-wide buff. Collecting Gold, Lumber, and Food across an entire zone would give players honor in return. The system is much different than what Blizzard created.
You're right. Warhammer wasnt your EXACT idea. Nor was Blizzards implementation of encouraging world PvP events in zones, but your idea is not new... Your idea is a variation of these ideas that have been done. Done to death. Changing a small variable in an idea that has demonstratively not worked probably wont change the outcome of the idea. Watch this...

I want Blizzard to encourage world PvP. So I want airdrops. Airdrops are so cool. Airdrops give loot. Loot is SO cool. I want zepplins to random drop airdrops once per day so that players can fight over airdrops. Sound familiar? Its your treasure chest idea in the form of an airdrop (inspired by the generation of gamers who love battle royale games) combined with your new random world PvP event idea. Would you consider that a new idea? I wouldnt. Its the same thing. Its awful for the same reasons. It took me about 30 seconds to think up.

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Gotta give him points for his dedication to all the trolling :mrgreen:

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Stfuppercut wrote:
3 months ago
RedridgeGnoll wrote:
3 months ago
The Warhammer Online campaigns aren't exactly the same thing as this Battlezone concept. The battlegrounds in Warhammer gave such lopsided rewards, so players only focused on doing bgs. The Zone Capture stuff was also really bugged and confusing. I agree it was a total failure.

The idea is to make it an alternative to honor farming in the battlegrounds all day. It wouldn't necessarily be active 24/7. The resource nodes would be spread out across the map of the designated zone, and you would still be at risk while turning them in. If you see another player roaming around gathering resources, you would have incentive to kill them, because they might be carrying a lot. Why would players roam in a pack, when only one player could loot the resource nodes. You would be incentivized to split up in smaller groups or even solo to keep more resources for yourself. The more resources you contribute, the more honor you earn. It is a simple mechanic that has major benefits. If there is too much competition or players in the zone, then that means that it's probably appealing.

The stuff that Blizzard added was like Tower captuires in EPL and Hellfire Peninsula. The reward was like a zone-wide buff. Collecting Gold, Lumber, and Food across an entire zone would give players honor in return. The system is much different than what Blizzard created.
You're right. Warhammer wasnt your EXACT idea. Nor was Blizzards implementation of encouraging world PvP events in zones, but your idea is not new... Your idea is a variation of these ideas that have been done. Done to death. Changing a small variable in an idea that has demonstratively not worked probably wont change the outcome of the idea. Watch this...

I want Blizzard to encourage world PvP. So I want airdrops. Airdrops are so cool. Airdrops give loot. Loot is SO cool. I want zepplins to random drop airdrops once per day so that players can fight over airdrops. Sound familiar? Its your treasure chest idea in the form of an airdrop (inspired by the generation of gamers who love battle royale games) combined with your new random world PvP event idea. Would you consider that a new idea? I wouldnt. Its the same thing. Its awful for the same reasons. It took me about 30 seconds to think up.
Let's say Winterspring is the new Battlezone. Turning in Gold, Lumber, Food gives players bonus honor when the battle ends. Players flood into Winterspring looking for these resources. Horde and Alliance begin to cross paths. Instead of Turn-in NPCs, lets say that once you collect 25 of a resource it gets removed from your inventory and added to the resource score. So you loot 20 lumber, then kill a player and loot 10 lumber off of that player. You contribute 25 lumber to the resource score, and get left with 5 in your inventory. You then seek out more resources, and encounter enemy players along the way. Why wouldn't this work or be fun? Especially, if you could get thousands of bonus honor potentially?

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ShamelessEU wrote:
3 months ago
Gotta give him points for his dedication to all the trolling :mrgreen:
I thought he was a troll for awhile... But I looked at his post history and I think hes actually serious... Its frightening.

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Stfuppercut wrote:
3 months ago
ShamelessEU wrote:
3 months ago
Gotta give him points for his dedication to all the trolling :mrgreen:
I thought he was a troll for awhile... But I looked at his post history and I think hes actually serious... Its frightening.
Why wouldn't players be interested in this if they could earn thousands of honor collecting resources and looting other players? The better the reward, the more competition and players in the zone. Isn't that a good thing?

"Any PvP idea that involves gaining honor without forcing players to fight and kill one another, is a TERRIBLE idea." Most of the honor from Battlegrounds is earned through objectives. Look at 1.12 Alterac valley, which is mostly a PvE guard battle.

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RedridgeGnoll wrote:
3 months ago
Why wouldn't players be interested in this if they could earn thousands of honor collecting resources and looting other players? The better the reward, the more competition and players in the zone. Isn't that a good thing?
I honestly cant do this... Haha. This is borderline cyberbullying. The idea has been done. Its not a good idea. It has not worked. If you are not interested in Classic, you should try to play something else.

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Stfuppercut wrote:
3 months ago
ShamelessEU wrote:
3 months ago
Gotta give him points for his dedication to all the trolling :mrgreen:
I thought he was a troll for awhile... But I looked at his post history and I think hes actually serious... Its frightening.
He is clearly trolling

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This doesn’t sound that great and for the love of anything, please no airdrops in classic :eek:

Btw Warhammer Online was pretty cool.

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Stfuppercut wrote:
3 months ago
Would be the exact same as AV trains that ride right beside eachother.
I think this is really the biggest thing. For the min/max people, having a way of gaining honor without the need to fight people would mean they would just focus on gathering resources. It would be way faster than fighting someone and risking death, in which case no honor could be gained.

If you tone down the honor gain from gathering resources to the point that it incentivizes fighting, people will most likely just go back to battlegrounds because whats the point of doing the zone pvp? Battlegrounds are structured and more reliable as far as honor goes.

I think Vanilla does a good job of creating world pvp opportunities already. Not having flying mounts, and having a world that is inhabited by both lowbies and max level characters at the same time will, I think make world pvp more exciting than it has been in wow for a long time.

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What are some pitfalls with this idea? Why wouldn't it be popular? I am just looking for specific feedback.

In Silithus, Blizzard added The Silithyst Must Flow during Classic.

To pick up Silithyst, locate a geyser and pick it up. The geyser will despawn, and the player will be carrying the Silithyst. While carrying it, your movement speed is reduced (abilities like "Sprint" will not have any effect) and you will be unable to mount without dropping the Silithyst. The other way of getting Silithyst is locating a player of the opposing faction carrying some. Upon damaging that player, he will drop his/her Silithyst, creating a Silithyst Mound allowing any player to temporarily pick up the Silithyst.

After collecting Silithyst, the player should run to the faction's turn in point, displayed on the map. A player may only carry one Silithyst at any time, so after each pickup, you will have to run and turn it in. The first faction to collect 200 Silithyst wins the race.

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ShamelessEU wrote:
3 months ago
Stfuppercut wrote:
3 months ago
ShamelessEU wrote:
3 months ago
Gotta give him points for his dedication to all the trolling :mrgreen:
I thought he was a troll for awhile... But I looked at his post history and I think hes actually serious... Its frightening.
He is clearly trolling
I don't want Classic WoW PvP to be defined by standing in Orgrimmar spamming battlegrounds 24/7. I am offering an alternative to that scenario. This new system could be a lot more dynamic than sitting Farm in AB all day.

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@RedridgeGnoll It's a bad idea primarily because it deviates from Classic WoW. Most people who are lined up to play this game, aren't looking for improvements to the original. They are looking for the original and all of the quirks and flaws and nuances that come with it.

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Silithus never had anything good come from it and I think your idea would interfere with BGs and WPvP too much.
As it stands BGs and WPvP have their offering and it’s pretty well balanced in regard to time/reward and allows players to make a choice.

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MeatLumps wrote:
3 months ago
Stfuppercut wrote:
3 months ago
Would be the exact same as AV trains that ride right beside eachother.
I think this is really the biggest thing. For the min/max people, having a way of gaining honor without the need to fight people would mean they would just focus on gathering resources. It would be way faster than fighting someone and risking death, in which case no honor could be gained.

If you tone down the honor gain from gathering resources to the point that it incentivizes fighting, people will most likely just go back to battlegrounds because whats the point of doing the zone pvp? Battlegrounds are structured and more reliable as far as honor goes.

I think Vanilla does a good job of creating world pvp opportunities already. Not having flying mounts, and having a world that is inhabited by both lowbies and max level characters at the same time will, I think make world pvp more exciting than it has been in wow for a long time.
You make some reasonable points. However, you wouldn't be able to contribute to your faction's score unless you gathered 25 Gold, Lumber, or Food. Let's say each node has 5 of each resource. You would need to loot 5 nodes of one resource to contribute to the score and receive the honor bonus. If you were at 15 Lumber and 20 Gold, and you got ganked, then you would drop all of your resources. This would incentivize fighting another player, because they might be carry a lot of resources.

Players would roam around the zones gathering resources, but also weigh the risk/reward of fighting another player.

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But why fight and risk it if both can go along doing their own thing having both gain rewards, unless it’s an entire gankfest much like how the Darkshore event was.

I don’t see the incentive to fight unless I have them outnumbered or there is no way I’m going to lose with your system in mind.

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Tec wrote:
3 months ago
Silithus never had anything good come from it and I think your idea would interfere with BGs and WPvP too much.
As it stands BGs and WPvP have their offering and it’s pretty well balanced in regard to time/reward and allows players to make a choice.
Battlegrounds offer like 10x as much honor as doing World PvP. How can you say its balanced. In Classic, the queue times will be short due to Crossrealm, and you can also queue inside of Capital Cities. That is more like Retail than how it worked for most of Classic. The PvP community in Classic will be huge, and I am concerned that Arathi Basin and WSG all day will not hold their interest long. We all know how unpopular 1.12 AV will be. WoW is an open world MMO, so why not have better open world PvP. I am not saying change battlegrounds, but offer another PvP alternative.

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Tec wrote:
3 months ago
But why fight and risk it if both can go along doing their own thing having both gain rewards, unless it’s an entire gankfest much like how the Darkshore event was.

I don’t see the incentive to fight unless I have them outnumbered or there is no way I’m going to lose with your system in mind.
There are times when one player might have more to lose than another. Let's say you just finished collecting 25 Lumber. That 25 lumber is taken from your inventory and added to your faction resource score. You don't have any lumber to lose at that point, so you may seek out an enemy to gank. You then gank somebody and loot 15 lumber off them. You would constantly be at risk of losing all of your resources.

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RedridgeGnoll wrote:
3 months ago
Tec wrote:
3 months ago
Silithus never had anything good come from it and I think your idea would interfere with BGs and WPvP too much.
As it stands BGs and WPvP have their offering and it’s pretty well balanced in regard to time/reward and allows players to make a choice.
Silithus had terrible rewards and the mechanics were clunky.

Battlegrounds offer like 10x as much honor as doing World PvP. How can you say its balanced. In Classic, the queue times will be short due to Crossrealm, and you can also queue inside of Capital Cities. That is more like Retail than how it worked for most of Classic. The PvP community in Classic will be hugw, and I am concerned that Arathi Basin and WSG all day will not hold their interest long. We all know how unpopular 1.12 AV will be. WoW is an open world MMO, so why not have better open world PvP. I am not saying change battlegrounds, but offer another PvP alternative.
I love 1.12 AV and the reason I say WPvP is balanced is due to material gathering in addition to whatever honor you get.

It’s two approaches to rewards, different rewards but equally attractive.

I don’t think you should be worried about cross realm PvP, I believe it’s for the betterment of the PvP community as opposed to a negative.

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Tec wrote:
3 months ago
RedridgeGnoll wrote:
3 months ago
Tec wrote:
3 months ago
Silithus never had anything good come from it and I think your idea would interfere with BGs and WPvP too much.
As it stands BGs and WPvP have their offering and it’s pretty well balanced in regard to time/reward and allows players to make a choice.
Silithus had terrible rewards and the mechanics were clunky.

Battlegrounds offer like 10x as much honor as doing World PvP. How can you say its balanced. In Classic, the queue times will be short due to Crossrealm, and you can also queue inside of Capital Cities. That is more like Retail than how it worked for most of Classic. The PvP community in Classic will be hugw, and I am concerned that Arathi Basin and WSG all day will not hold their interest long. We all know how unpopular 1.12 AV will be. WoW is an open world MMO, so why not have better open world PvP. I am not saying change battlegrounds, but offer another PvP alternative.
I love 1.12 AV and the reason I say WPvP is balanced is due to material gathering in addition to whatever honor you get.

It’s two approaches to rewards, different rewards but equally attractive.

I don’t think you should be worried about cross realm PvP, I believe it’s for the betterment of the PvP community as opposed to a negative.
The idea is to offer an alternative way to farm honor. Farming honor in World PvP will not be viable once Battlegrounds are released. This combines the mechanics of PvP loot and resource gathering into the open world zones. Instead of being forced to play Arathi Basin all day, what if you could PvP in 10 different zones and possibly earn comparable Honor. It is an open world MMO afterall. I appreciate your criticism, as the idea is flawed in some ways. I am trying to figure out why it might not work or be popular.

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RedridgeGnoll wrote:
3 months ago
There are times when one player might have more to lose than another. Let's say you just finished collecting 25 Lumber. That 25 lumber is taken from your inventory and added to your faction resource score. You don't have any lumber to lose at that point, so you may seek out an enemy to gank. You then gank somebody and loot 15 lumber off them. You would constantly be at risk of losing all of your resources.
What I am losing by killing the other person in this scenario is the time that I could spend picking up more resources to get more honor. There is no reason for me to kill that other faction player apart from the fun of it and some honor from the kill.

Youre right that I am not at risk of losing any resource I am carrying. The risk is that I lose the fight and then have wasted time I could have spent gathering resources.

If this system were implemented and I was trying to maximize my honor, i can tell you up front that I would focus entirely on gathering resources. Not on fighting.

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MeatLumps wrote:
3 months ago
RedridgeGnoll wrote:
3 months ago
There are times when one player might have more to lose than another. Let's say you just finished collecting 25 Lumber. That 25 lumber is taken from your inventory and added to your faction resource score. You don't have any lumber to lose at that point, so you may seek out an enemy to gank. You then gank somebody and loot 15 lumber off them. You would constantly be at risk of losing all of your resources.
What I am losing by killing the other person in this scenario is the time that I could spend picking up more resources to get more honor. There is no reason for me to kill that other faction player apart from the fun of it and some honor from the kill.

Youre right that I am not at risk of losing any resource I am carrying. The risk is that I lose the fight and then have wasted time I could have spent gathering resources.

If this system were implemented and I was trying to maximize my honor, i can tell you up front that I would focus entirely on gathering resources. Not on fighting.
Because if you killed that other player, they might drop 20 Gold, 15 Lumber, and 15 Food. Killing that player might reap far faster rewards than roaming the zone and gathering more resources. If you think you can win a fight, why would you not attack them, especially if you already capped 25 resources.

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