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I agree that they are most effected by it, but that doesnt necessarily means it that bad, since warriors have weapon skill options the glancing blows wont be that bad, so Rage generation is hardly affected there (It also seems that rage generated from damage dealt is higher on the classic beta vs private servers on lower levels, huh imagine that, that could translate into higher threat at max level aswell. Impossible to tell without actuall testing) So in the end it actually might be straight up better or almost no difference, Impossible to tell at this moment without any raids. But unlike you I don't just plainout lie about stuff before doing real unbiased testing.

And let me explain why DW warriors wont "Reckbomb themselfs" Since you dont even know what parry haste is, First they can only benefit once from parry haste between attacks, and to get 40% less on their swingtime they are going to need to perfectly time parry 0.01 second after their auto attack, otherwise its not going to have as a big effect. If 1 second have gone by before they manage to parry, the parry haste is going to push the auto attack forward by around 0,4 seconds vs if its straight after its auto attack (assuming it have 2.0 speed) 0,8 seconds. So they will do very slightly more damage, almost insignificant, A perfectly timed parry will never happen so. Fury warriors DW are already generating so much Rage so its going to be fine without a doubt.

And lets not forget that you're contradicting yourself with (4 times lower damage bla bla bla) with then saying that parry haste will kill a warrior? Jesus dude you're all over the place, makes you look like a freaking clown. Even if its pure bullshit.
Yeah sure 14% Parry on a 1hander = each 6th swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.
14% on a Duel Wield = each 3rd swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.

You know the drill ... It's not like you can time double weapons , because they aren't 2hander slow weapon and especially not 1hander slow weapon.

There is no such thing as perfectly timed parry on a Duel Wield Warrior , there is only perfectly reckbombed Warrior Tank thanks to Duel Wield , or even Worse = Druid bombing himself thanks to MCP !

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As I said earlier you ran oom several times, and you didnt spam your abilties, you didnt have 100% upptime on consecration, holy shield and exorcism. Next time fight an undead target because thats the only target a paladin can use its full potential against, which isnt even impressing.
When i am going to use Holy Shield and Exorcism , i won't have a need of Consecration , because Consecration is poor threat versus single target compare to Holy Shield and Exorcism.

On top of that, Holy Shield and Exorcism are way lower mana consumers compare to Consecration.

Only noobs prio Consecration against Single Target compare to other spells.

Straight your facts before you say something you have no idea how it work.

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Yawn.. Warriors have more or less the same avoidance as a Paladin without a damn shield, and can still reach armor cap so. Who cares? Crushing blows/crits doesnt kill Warriors/Druids unlike Paladins that have very limited gear and hp, 2k less hp unbuffed vs warriors. And even if its a boss thats hits hard enough to warrant a shield, Fury/prot warriors can still use one and still get the benefit from the specc, which you don't seem to understand. While it slightly reduced their TPS and Rage gain. They are still miles above paladins 0 mana strategies.
Anyone who dare to say Paladins have Mana issues should learn basics and go back to 2005.

Yeah sure, Warrior without Block versus Paladin with Parry/Dodge/Block all together.

Sorry but Parry Haste are going to swallow your Warrior Avoidance + Crits/Blows on you!

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Sure, its just basic math, doesnt need any proof. Just some simple calculations based on the available gear and fights and some simulations. since warriors are going to have defensive stance, way higher avoidance from block/dodge/parry. It all adds up in the end. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... ub/pubhtml#

Go check it out yourself, you might actually learn something. If thats even possible.
I don't need Taladril Private Server documents , i need pure evidence and proof from Original Vanilla since you claim that Paladins are going to eat 50% more damage in Naxx!

So far i see no pure evidence ,just private servers fake documents filled with lots of errors and monolithic guide ignoring other ways and views.

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GZ! Screenshots as proof, My my how credible! Are you even trying at this point or are you actually suffering from a disability? Those are from private servers! And you're not even tanking Thaddius since you're not even on the threat meter, the tank probably died in the last second.
If Tank died in the last second and i am not even on the threat meter , why Boss is being Tanked by Paladin Tank then!?

^ more of them excuses .
Guest wrote:
1 month ago
You're oom (With mana potion on CD HAHA) on Maexxna and the boss isnt even at 70% haha with almost getting overaggroed on the threat meter, GJ! Really seeing that potential there. I bet that attempt was a whipefest. Atleast these screenshots prove how damn horrible prot paladins are. So thank you for that. (You're dead when she enrages and does her last web wrap but you know that, thats why you use pictures instead of videos)
But you forgot there is Demonic Rune CD ready and not used + The fact that there is no Judgement of Wisdom + The fact that there is innervates ready for it.

I guess you are Skarm (assuming) who always denigrate paladins filled with ignorance and hate against Paladin Tanks , but pretend as an expert of Paladins :)

No wonder why i see fake profile here not even registered on the site , throwing an insults 24/24 :)

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killerduki wrote:
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1 month ago
Okay lets break down that video abit, to see why its a shotgun loaded with bullshit.

Lets start with the obvious one, Flask of supreme power.. Really? You already have a very small hp pool vs druids/warriors. You really going to skip out on titans? No. You're forced to use it.

SoR doesnt proc either Shadow oil or Dragonsbreaths chili on classic, which it does in your video. So those are going to do alot less.

24% of your threat in that video comes from "white" damage, add on SoR to that and its alot more. If the target keeps parrying/dodging you its going to result in alot less threat from this, same with glancing, reducing the threat you deal since you deal less damage. and yes the same goes for warriors/druids but saying that it affects them isnt an argument so stop bringing it up. I'm bringing it up since its a non factor in your "based" TPS on a level 1 target test.

You aren't spamming your abilities (not even consecration lol, you see it wear of alot of time not even managing 100% upptime), if you are tanking with this gear you're most likely tanking Naxx content which means you need mana for both Holy shield and Exorcism. which are 2 costly applities that you are currently ignoring. And lets not forget that JoW doesnt proc on SoR, and wont even be allowed as a "debuff" in any respectable guild. when you instead can replace it with really great damage increasing debuffs for fire mages etc.

And lastly, a paladin will never ever have Thunderfury. Even if you are tanking in a guild as a paladin. Its unreasonable to not give the warrior Thunderfury since it does Way way way more threat for warriors. first the 1,495 modifier to the proc and 1.33 attackspeed from flurry + spammable attacks every 1.5 second makes them proc Thunderfury so much more. Since paladins only have the double chance to proc it (But can't actually get double procs in the same swing so its kinda bad) and since TF is 19% of your threat here, we're probably down to a realistic 300-400 TPS.

Adding in Exocism and Holy shield (retribution aura and sanctuary) will increase your threat by alot, for a very limited time. but with those up you probably round back to around 600-700 tps again for aslong as you have mana, which should run oom in about 30 seconds - 1 minute spamming all those abilities. With mana/runes. then after that all you got are white swings and thorns, which doesnt add up to much.

And dont link your stupid fucking list about consumables, because other tanks have those aswell and warriors and druids scale way better with worldbuffs and consumables then paladins does, so thats a mute point.
Your ignorance is nice , so ill re quote the whole discussion you completely ignoring to read before you write all of this:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1655&start=125

You know how much of White Swings reduced are going to change the same threat for Paladin?! Perhaps 5% of what you see, tell us now how much lower Rage Generation is going to be for a Warrior being affected by Glancing Blows and how much lower threat by White Swings is going to be thanks to Glancing Blows affected by Defiance and Def Stance?!

Now to debunk the very same Video :

646.7 TPS = 1k DPS handling and that's without :

1- Holy Shield
2- Retribution Aura
3- Blessing of Sanctuary
4- Sanctity Aura
5- All 3 Judgements at once
6- Exorcism
7- Parry Haste
8- Innervates
9- Power Infusion
10- Holy Mightstone
11- Holy Water
12- Crit Buff by group.
13- World Buffs (all of them)
14- Hunter Pet Buff
15- Blessing of Might
16- Blessing of King
17- Warrior Shouts


Did you know that with all of these (perhaps i missed some) , you can certainly improve threat 2-3 times higher than this threat on sitting target Dummy?!

Did you know that all the SoR procs (which wont exists in original Classic) will not even reduce our threat by 5% ?!

How much Warrior Tanks and Druid Tanks are going to be nerfed in original Classic due to Glancing Blows, reduced Crit by 4 times (which it is beneficial bug for them in pservers) are going to suffer when original classic release??!
Haha so awesome, the only thing you could do was to link this list again. You couldn't even respond to the things that I said because you knew they were all true. so you had to reply with this and it totally makes you look like a fucking idiot even when I told you in said post to not link this. But hey can't argue with a braindead person, how goes that saying again? Debating creationists on the topic of evolution is rather like trying to play chess with a pigeon — it knocks the pieces over, craps on the board, and flies back to its flock to claim victory.

Thats how you argue. But to be fair you're probably both a creationist and a flat earther with how damn stupid all your "proof" are. Everything is just baseless claims thanks for proving that yet again!

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killerduki wrote:
1 month ago
Guest wrote:
1 month ago
I agree that they are most effected by it, but that doesnt necessarily means it that bad, since warriors have weapon skill options the glancing blows wont be that bad, so Rage generation is hardly affected there (It also seems that rage generated from damage dealt is higher on the classic beta vs private servers on lower levels, huh imagine that, that could translate into higher threat at max level aswell. Impossible to tell without actuall testing) So in the end it actually might be straight up better or almost no difference, Impossible to tell at this moment without any raids. But unlike you I don't just plainout lie about stuff before doing real unbiased testing.

And let me explain why DW warriors wont "Reckbomb themselfs" Since you dont even know what parry haste is, First they can only benefit once from parry haste between attacks, and to get 40% less on their swingtime they are going to need to perfectly time parry 0.01 second after their auto attack, otherwise its not going to have as a big effect. If 1 second have gone by before they manage to parry, the parry haste is going to push the auto attack forward by around 0,4 seconds vs if its straight after its auto attack (assuming it have 2.0 speed) 0,8 seconds. So they will do very slightly more damage, almost insignificant, A perfectly timed parry will never happen so. Fury warriors DW are already generating so much Rage so its going to be fine without a doubt.

And lets not forget that you're contradicting yourself with (4 times lower damage bla bla bla) with then saying that parry haste will kill a warrior? Jesus dude you're all over the place, makes you look like a freaking clown. Even if its pure bullshit.
Yeah sure 14% Parry on a 1hander = each 6th swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.
14% on a Duel Wield = each 3rd swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.

You know the drill ... It's not like you can time double weapons , because they aren't 2hander slow weapon and especially not 1hander slow weapon.

There is no such thing as perfectly timed parry on a Duel Wield Warrior , there is only perfectly reckbombed Warrior Tank thanks to Duel Wield , or even Worse = Druid bombing himself thanks to MCP !
If the one handed weapons have the same speed, they attack at the same time? You didnt know that. Huh you really are uneducated on basic mechanics.

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killerduki wrote:
1 month ago
Yeah sure 14% Parry on a 1hander = each 6th swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.
14% on a Duel Wield = each 3rd swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.
And no its not a "extra boss swing" its increased swing timer... Please tell me you understand the difference? I fucking explained it for you. Seek help

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Bigdaddy wrote:
1 month ago
killerduki wrote:
1 month ago
Guest wrote:
1 month ago
I agree that they are most effected by it, but that doesnt necessarily means it that bad, since warriors have weapon skill options the glancing blows wont be that bad, so Rage generation is hardly affected there (It also seems that rage generated from damage dealt is higher on the classic beta vs private servers on lower levels, huh imagine that, that could translate into higher threat at max level aswell. Impossible to tell without actuall testing) So in the end it actually might be straight up better or almost no difference, Impossible to tell at this moment without any raids. But unlike you I don't just plainout lie about stuff before doing real unbiased testing.

And let me explain why DW warriors wont "Reckbomb themselfs" Since you dont even know what parry haste is, First they can only benefit once from parry haste between attacks, and to get 40% less on their swingtime they are going to need to perfectly time parry 0.01 second after their auto attack, otherwise its not going to have as a big effect. If 1 second have gone by before they manage to parry, the parry haste is going to push the auto attack forward by around 0,4 seconds vs if its straight after its auto attack (assuming it have 2.0 speed) 0,8 seconds. So they will do very slightly more damage, almost insignificant, A perfectly timed parry will never happen so. Fury warriors DW are already generating so much Rage so its going to be fine without a doubt.

And lets not forget that you're contradicting yourself with (4 times lower damage bla bla bla) with then saying that parry haste will kill a warrior? Jesus dude you're all over the place, makes you look like a freaking clown. Even if its pure bullshit.
Yeah sure 14% Parry on a 1hander = each 6th swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.
14% on a Duel Wield = each 3rd swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.

You know the drill ... It's not like you can time double weapons , because they aren't 2hander slow weapon and especially not 1hander slow weapon.

There is no such thing as perfectly timed parry on a Duel Wield Warrior , there is only perfectly reckbombed Warrior Tank thanks to Duel Wield , or even Worse = Druid bombing himself thanks to MCP !
If the one handed weapons have the same speed, they attack at the same time? You didnt know that. Huh you really are uneducated on basic mechanics.
Like 14% become 28% when using DW , it's not a skyrocked science.

1 weapon is 14% , 2x weapons is 28% .

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Bigdaddy wrote:
1 month ago
killerduki wrote:
1 month ago
Yeah sure 14% Parry on a 1hander = each 6th swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.
14% on a Duel Wield = each 3rd swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.
And no its not a "extra boss swing" its increased swing timer... Please tell me you understand the difference? I fucking explained it for you. Seek help
Sure instead of getting hit within 2 seconds (average boss swing timer), you are getting hit within 0.8 seconds.

Imagine in a fight with 5 minutes = 300 seconds = 300++ swings eaten as DW Warrior or MCP Druid. Instead of eating 150 swings as Paladin.

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killerduki wrote:
1 month ago
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1 month ago
As I said earlier you ran oom several times, and you didnt spam your abilties, you didnt have 100% upptime on consecration, holy shield and exorcism. Next time fight an undead target because thats the only target a paladin can use its full potential against, which isnt even impressing.
When i am going to use Holy Shield and Exorcism , i won't have a need of Consecration , because Consecration is poor threat versus single target compare to Holy Shield and Exorcism.

On top of that, Holy Shield and Exorcism are way lower mana consumers compare to Consecration.

Only noobs prio Consecration against Single Target compare to other spells.

Straight your facts before you say something you have no idea how it work.
For max threat, you Need to use everything! or else you wont even be able to hold threat against a fucking hunter pet. you can get choosy and only use some stuff. that bottlenecks your potentional threat. which Druid and Warriors doesnt suffer from. They can use everything at all times, and thats the main argument why they are better, which you indirectly proves by saying stupid shit like this.

And sure lets see, Holy shield costs 240 mana and Exorcism costs 345 mana, they both offer around a 60-70 base-TPS increase, they have scaling but you wont have that much spell power anyway so it doesnt matter in that gear. then we have consecration that costs 565 mana that you are going to need to spam to not lose threat from a warrior in the same gear. using just 1 rotation of those 3 abilties, are going to put you down to 70% mana, adding Judgement and SoR its going to put you down on 60% mana. And no you wont ever have JoW so stop being delusional. Its a shitty debuff where better debuffs can be applied.

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Bigdaddy wrote:
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For max threat, you Need to use everything! or else you wont even be able to hold threat against a fucking hunter pet. you can get choosy and only use some stuff. that bottlenecks your potentional threat. which Druid and Warriors doesnt suffer from. They can use everything at all times, and thats the main argument why they are better, which you indirectly proves by saying stupid shit like this.
It's up to you to proove that Warriors and Druids are going to do more threat.

Especially against Paladin increased threat where Consecration is going to be reduced and instead prio Holy Shield Exorcism on CD!

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killerduki wrote:
1 month ago
Bigdaddy wrote:
1 month ago
killerduki wrote:
1 month ago
Yeah sure 14% Parry on a 1hander = each 6th swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.
14% on a Duel Wield = each 3rd swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.
And no its not a "extra boss swing" its increased swing timer... Please tell me you understand the difference? I fucking explained it for you. Seek help
Sure instead of getting hit within 2 seconds (average boss swing timer), you are getting hit within 0.8 seconds.

Imagine in a fight with 5 minutes = 300 seconds = 300++ swings eaten as DW Warrior or MCP Druid. Instead of eating 150 swings as Paladin.
No thats not how it fucking works...... Jesus you are really damn stupid how do you not get this? If the boss perfectly time a parry just after he have auto attacked he is going to get a swing timer of 1.2 seconds! not 0.8 thats a 60% increase you moron.

A perfect parry will never happen, what is more likely is that he will be at like 1 second left untill he will auto attack. THEN he parrys and reduces that time to 0.6 second vs 1 second! WOW 0.4 Second increase in his swing timer SUPER dangerous!

Learn the basic fucking mechanics you moron

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Bigdaddy wrote:
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And no you wont ever have JoW so stop being delusional. Its a shitty debuff where better debuffs can be applied.
See how far your ignorance goes...

So your logic is "You must tank like this as Paladin" , but "If you tank like that as Paladin,then you should not be allowed to use this" . ....

That's like telling you to never use Sunders as Warrior Tank because it's terrible debuff where better caster debuffs can be applied...

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Bigdaddy wrote:
1 month ago
killerduki wrote:
1 month ago
Bigdaddy wrote:
1 month ago
killerduki wrote:
1 month ago
Yeah sure 14% Parry on a 1hander = each 6th swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.
14% on a Duel Wield = each 3rd swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.
And no its not a "extra boss swing" its increased swing timer... Please tell me you understand the difference? I fucking explained it for you. Seek help
Sure instead of getting hit within 2 seconds (average boss swing timer), you are getting hit within 0.8 seconds.

Imagine in a fight with 5 minutes = 300 seconds = 300++ swings eaten as DW Warrior or MCP Druid. Instead of eating 150 swings as Paladin.
No thats not how it fucking works...... Jesus you are really damn stupid how do you not get this? If the boss perfectly time a parry just after he have auto attacked he is going to get a swing timer of 1.2 seconds! not 0.8 thats a 60% increase you moron.

A perfect parry will never happen, what is more likely is that he will be at like 1 second left untill he will auto attack. THEN he parrys and reduces that time to 0.6 second vs 1 second! WOW 0.4 Second increase in his swing timer SUPER dangerous!

Learn the basic fucking mechanics you moron
So imagine how much perfect parry will happen with DW warrior being unable to control his 2x 1hander weapons...

Each 0.6 seconds in 300 seconds = nearly 500 swings Warrior he is going to eat from Boss.

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killerduki wrote:
1 month ago
Bigdaddy wrote:
1 month ago
For max threat, you Need to use everything! or else you wont even be able to hold threat against a fucking hunter pet. you can get choosy and only use some stuff. that bottlenecks your potentional threat. which Druid and Warriors doesnt suffer from. They can use everything at all times, and thats the main argument why they are better, which you indirectly proves by saying stupid shit like this.
It's up to you to proove that Warriors and Druids are going to do more threat.

Especially against Paladin increased threat where Consecration is going to be reduced and instead prio Holy Shield Exorcism on CD!
Its not up to me? Its up to you, show me a video of a Paladin doing over 1,5k TPS for 3 minutes, Private server or not. You are the one claiming paladins can do better tps. Not anyone else, Only you! There are already logs, videos saying that Warriors/Druids can do well enough even back in vanilla. Yet not a single paladin tanks in any video back from vanilla. How about that? Thats proof enough. You have to defend your standpoint, not the other way around.

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Bigdaddy wrote:
1 month ago
killerduki wrote:
1 month ago
Bigdaddy wrote:
1 month ago
For max threat, you Need to use everything! or else you wont even be able to hold threat against a fucking hunter pet. you can get choosy and only use some stuff. that bottlenecks your potentional threat. which Druid and Warriors doesnt suffer from. They can use everything at all times, and thats the main argument why they are better, which you indirectly proves by saying stupid shit like this.
It's up to you to proove that Warriors and Druids are going to do more threat.

Especially against Paladin increased threat where Consecration is going to be reduced and instead prio Holy Shield Exorcism on CD!
Its not up to me? Its up to you, show me a video of a Paladin doing over 1,5k TPS for 3 minutes, Private server or not. You are the one claiming paladins can do better tps. Not anyone else, Only you! There are already logs, videos saying that Warriors/Druids can do well enough even back in vanilla. Yet not a single paladin tanks in any video back from vanilla. How about that? Thats proof enough. You have to defend your standpoint, not the other way around.
You are the one coming with claims like Warriors do 1.5 k TPS , Paladin have 50% less surviving than Warrior in Naxx.

You are the one claiming stuffs = prove them , it's not up to me to do that , it's your claims , provide us Vanilla Evidence for such claims.

We don't need words, we need proofs for claims!

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killerduki wrote:
1 month ago
Bigdaddy wrote:
1 month ago
killerduki wrote:
1 month ago
Bigdaddy wrote:
1 month ago
killerduki wrote:
1 month ago
Yeah sure 14% Parry on a 1hander = each 6th swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.
14% on a Duel Wield = each 3rd swing Warrior swinging = extra boss swing.
And no its not a "extra boss swing" its increased swing timer... Please tell me you understand the difference? I fucking explained it for you. Seek help
Sure instead of getting hit within 2 seconds (average boss swing timer), you are getting hit within 0.8 seconds.

Imagine in a fight with 5 minutes = 300 seconds = 300++ swings eaten as DW Warrior or MCP Druid. Instead of eating 150 swings as Paladin.
No thats not how it fucking works...... Jesus you are really damn stupid how do you not get this? If the boss perfectly time a parry just after he have auto attacked he is going to get a swing timer of 1.2 seconds! not 0.8 thats a 60% increase you moron.

A perfect parry will never happen, what is more likely is that he will be at like 1 second left untill he will auto attack. THEN he parrys and reduces that time to 0.6 second vs 1 second! WOW 0.4 Second increase in his swing timer SUPER dangerous!

Learn the basic fucking mechanics you moron
So imagine how much perfect parry will happen with DW warrior being unable to control his 2x 1hander weapons...

Each 0.6 seconds in 300 seconds = nearly 500 swings Warrior he is going to eat from Boss.
HAHAHA are you actually this braindead? Jesus you dont even know how to do basic math WTF. Dude Thank you for this, I can use this as proof to why everything you say is bullshit. Thank you sincerely.

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Prot Paladins, best paladins.

   killerduki
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Guys, there is no point to do any reasoning here. Just wait for launch and Let his failure speak for itself. Like Stfuppercut I will also check his youtube channel once in a while and I won't be surprised to see there will be no videos of him sucessfully main tanking trough content.

Expect the worst. Hope for the best.
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Week 1 clearing Ragnaros possible = ®by Skarm.

Now i see why these Trolls are so hardcore , preaching Skarm views and words as legit source.

Ladies and Gentlemen , the best Paladin/Warrior/Druid Tank expert has spoken . Time for Memes creating 1st week after release.

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Sure he can do it.


You can't tho.

Expect the worst. Hope for the best.
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killerduki wrote:
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Week 1 clearing Ragnaros possible = ®by Skarm.

Now i see why these Trolls are so hardcore , preaching Skarm views and words as legit source.

Ladies and Gentlemen , the best Paladin/Warrior/Druid Tank expert has spoken . Time for Memes creating 1st week after release.

you can clear MC with level 55 people. dont even have to be 60. Ofcourse ragnaros is going to die the first week, thinking something else is idiotic and shows how little you know about the HC community.

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Zephyr wrote:
1 month ago
Holyfrog wrote:
1 month ago
Ill also save Duki some time and post the Beta list we compiled over the last few months with Paladin spell behaviour on the Beta. That way there's no need to re-test mechanics and be confused over how they really work.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing
Hey, thanks a lot for this list!
So, so far (if these are not beta bugs), only oils/chili/JoL and JoW cannot be procced by SoR. If the proc off procs mechanic is also a thing (anyone could test it so far?), some combos like Axe of the Deep Woods + Fiery Blaze Enchantment + SoR + oil/chili + any judgement could be pretty interesting in some situations (especially with multiple targets).
Nah, 40 isnt high enough to start testing all the interesting weapons unfortuantely.

Fiery Blaze seem to proc on Seal of Righteousness though which is interesting.

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I have a hard time trying to comprehend arguing over pixels but I will say that prot paladins are the best paladins and you're a nerd if you disagree with me.

Dont let your memes be dreams. Fly freely like a butterfly and remember taunt is for cowards.

   killerduki
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