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I have played every class in WOTLK
now the dilema is Druid or Paladin?

I was a casual wow player, played mostly WOTLK. Have dinged rogue, warlock, and shaman. Shaman was my favorite, because you were wanted for the heals in the dungeons, so it was easier for me to gear up and find groups. But this time I have decided to play Alliance, cuz all my life I play Horde.
I want to experience vanilla tanking (that`s why Warrior is in the dilema aswell)

I am PVP guy, who wants to do some pve from time to time, and wants to have a spec, that works for both. I know, but Im just casual, so I don`t expect to top the meters.The problem is that I want all, but give up nothing. Deleting people, healing, mobility, CC (that`s why Mage is in the game), survivability . I`m really confused right now, so it will help if you start comparing Druid and Paladin and telling me why I should pick one of them.

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Do you have anybody that you will be playing with? That would strongly influence the comparative merits of each.

That said, druid is quite a bit more capable at tanking (at least, it is easier to gear up, more well understood today, and is quite viable) - and there are multiple druid specs that can do both Tanking/Healing or Tanking/DPS. You might particularly enjoy the 1/29/21 spec of Druid if you want a single spec that can Tank, Heal, PvE and PvP.

   moozu123
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moozu123 wrote:
1 year ago
now the dilema is Druid or Paladin?

I want to experience vanilla tanking (that`s why Warrior is in the dilema aswell)

I am PVP guy, who wants to do some pve from time to time, and wants to have a spec, that works for both.
Druid. Very easily druid.

Druids level quicker and can take a feral build which is both strong for leveling and tanking. At the dungeon stage, druid tanking is easier, with lower barriers to entry and more accepted by others. The cap of what a druid can tank reasonably (for the casual player that OP is) in vanilla is higher. Your spec will function as a feral druid in both PvE and PvP without any major issues or requirements to respec.

Bonus: as a feral druid, you are THE premier flag carrier in PvP. As a prot paladin, no one wants you in their BG. Premade groups will seek you out as a geared feral druid. No one will want you as a prot paladin in an organized group or otherwise.

If world PvP is appealing to you, the stealth that a druid has offers a lot more opportunities to cause mischief and to get deeper into enemy territory. It also provides a guaranteed method to avoid being corpse camped.

edit: INB4 someone links a video to an incredibly geared prot pally using hard to get items on a private server with odd item interactions while stacking 400g worth of consumes being followed by 3 pocket healers while wielding full raid buffs in a BG against pugs while playing in a sweaty premade.

   moozu123
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1 year ago
Never making a single investment again until I 100% know it pays off.
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As a seasoned vet of both paladins and druids, had max level of both through tbc to cata, though this advice will be from a vanilla perspective. I will preface this by saying I am going to main a druid and not play a paladin in classic.

If you want to

moozu123 wrote:
1 year ago
Deleting people, healing, mobility,CC
you can't really have all of them.

If you choose druid, you get healing, CC, and mobility, if you choose paladin you get healing, buffs and survivability. And if you want to delete people, don't play either of these classes.

Druids PvP style is my most favourite playstyle in all of vanilla and the only class that doesn't feel like it needs engineering to perform optimally. Contrast that with a Paladin where if you don't have engineering you will absolutely under perform in pvp.

   Stfuppercut Selexin moozu123
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Justbe wrote:
1 year ago
Druids PvP style is my most favourite playstyle in all of vanilla and the only class that doesn't feel like it needs engineering to perform optimally. Contrast that with a Paladin where if you don't have engineering you will absolutely under perform in pvp.
and PvE. Due to the lack of ranged options for a pally, and as a tank, he will need engi for PvE as well. There are many items, including shields, that are very impactful for a protadin.

   Selexin moozu123
g0bledyg00k wrote:
1 year ago
Never making a single investment again until I 100% know it pays off.
2000 IQ :wink:
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TJourney wrote:
1 year ago
Do you have anybody that you will be playing with? That would strongly influence the comparative merits of each.
Yes, I have a Rogue, hunter and mage to play with. Im more inclined to roll druid, tested it in Retro wow and the fighting style suits me (going HotW spec). Going out of form, putin dots, go in bear, feral charge, run away in travel - its just soooo versatile. It has more options like Nature`s grace/ NS for more big bum bam crit numbers after well geared.

I hated the fighting style of the paladin (tried holy-reckoning, i know, bad spec, cuz in Classic reckoning wont trigger by /sit macro) , but loved the fact I can help players with cleanse, BoF, BoP and HoJ, really nice tools. But once big geared mage or warlock target me - I can`t play well, don`t get me wrong, but I got deleted . Posibly I can delay dying with 15 sec due to LoH and Divine shield. With the druid is the same, but you can outrange them .. idunno.

The other thing I love about the paladin is that I tried to lvl up one in Light`s hope and really enjoyed every new hammer or piece of gear, I knew I got more badass. Also the ability to handle 2 mobs at once was priceless. But with druid you wont see that gear...

So basicaly Im thorn apart from favorite pvp playstyle and lore. Also I absolutely love to lvl up in Northshire valley. Both classes are pictured in my head as guardians of your friends and that is what I wanna roll.

I know how whiny I sound , and I am almost sure I will roll druid, but I think Im missing out from the pally.

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moozu123 wrote:
1 year ago
I know how whiny I sound
No, it's definitely a difficult decision. I absolutely LOVED paladins in every iteration of WoW that came after vanilla. In vanilla I just felt like all I could really do was support my allies. I never felt like I could be self sufficient in any way. Say you're out in the world leveling and you see a horde and you want to jump him and kill him. Well... yea, that's likely not going to happen. At worst, the horde will kill you, at best you will get in some good hits but then the horde will just run away because paladins don't really have a gap closer other than one stun on a 1 minute cooldown. Even at end game I felt like I couldn't deal any damage as a paladin. Paladin really needed crusader strike or any kind of ability they could use off cooldown to deal some damage that isn't a judgement.

Druids can actually kill things. A phase 1 BiS druid is actually really damn powerful and probably will be the best phase for druids, and phase 2 I could see an argument for as well. Go on retro wow and get all the BiS gear from the vendors there (can get most of it, might miss a few pieces here and there) but you will still be able to take people in a duel that out gear you. If you're a paladin and you dont have Might of Menethil or Ashbringer or some big fuck off scary weapon, you're really not going to deal any damage.

Druids are about as self sufficient as you can get and probably why I love them so much. I play with friends often, but I don't always play with friends and I find myself alone in the world a lot. So just knowing that I can actually kill things, or if things really turn sour, I can run away is comforting. Also, druids are great at solo farming as well, they can tank (waaaaay better than a paladin), heal (not as good as a paladin, but still healing is healing), and damage (better than a paladin).

It's a tough call, but you need to think about what is important to you in the game. Do you want to feel like a holy crusader who stands up for the party, or do you want to feel like a guardian of nature who can choose to say in the sidelines or choose to rush in and protect your allies? They both have similar roles in groups so either decision you make won't hurt you too much.

Personally, I would roll a druid (which I am) because they're way more versatile than a paladin, they are absolute monsters in wPvP, the best flag carriers in the game (which means you are the reason for WSG victories), and extremely self sufficient and don't need to rely on others as much as you would with a paladin. Just my two cents.

   teebling
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I would roll a druid between those two.
You feel like dpsing today? Go ahead.
Wanna tank? Do it so.
Your 5man lacks a healer? They have you.

Don't want to PvP? Entangling roots ---> Teleport: Moonglade.

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Stupeed wrote:
1 year ago
I would roll a druid between those two.
You feel like dpsing today? Go ahead.
Wanna tank? Do it so.
Your 5man lacks a healer? They have you.

Don't want to PvP? Entangling roots ---> Teleport: Moonglade.
I see what you did there.

I would roll a Paladin between those two.
You feel like dpsing today? Go ahead.
Wanna tank? Do it so.
Your 5man lacks a healer? They have you.

Don't want to PvP? Bubble ---> Hearth: Stormwind.

   Stupeed Erik
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Stfuppercut wrote:
1 year ago

edit: INB4 someone links a video to an incredibly geared prot pally using hard to get items on a private server with odd item interactions while stacking 400g worth of consumes being followed by 3 pocket healers while wielding full raid buffs in a BG against pugs while playing in a sweaty premade.

   Stfuppercut
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zutch wrote:
1 year ago
Haha, it just always seems to be the case. Someone will end up trying to build an argument around why this poor guy should PvP as a prot paladin. This is a no-brainer. The guy wants to primarily PvP and wants to use a tank spec for both casual PvE and for doing BG's. He has narrowed his choices to druid or paladin. This is a set of tasks that feral druids can perform well. A prot paladin is not a thing in PvP. It would be horrible. I cant imagine that as my reality... If he takes a spec that makes him viable in 5 man dungeon as a protadin, that same spec will be terrible to play in BG's.

Can we find some outlier prot paladin with thunderfury and tier 2 gear that makes this work? Sure. This guy is casual and will be sporting a mismatch set of dungeon blues. I always try to assess the OP's post and then frame my answer around their needs; in this case, OP should quite clearly go druid.

g0bledyg00k wrote:
1 year ago
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you're absolutely right, Druid is a no brainer choice simply because it can fulfill 2 roles for both pvp and pve, i actually never heard of a prot pvp ! except holy/prot arena builds in wotlk ;p

   Stfuppercut
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Go Druid, so that I may have less competition. ;-)

Edit: Never mind, I changed my mind. Please go Paladin.

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Thanks, guys. Druid it is 90%. Last question. If we leave the tank side for awhile and consider me going to spend tons of gold for respec is ret paladin viable in pvp? Maybe viable is not the right word.. Does the ret paladin always need to be beside warrior to be eficient ? where is ret paladin`s place in WSG- offence or deffence?

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moozu123 wrote:
1 year ago
Thanks, guys. Druid it is 90%. Last question. If we leave the tank side for awhile and consider me going to spend tons of gold for respec is ret paladin viable in pvp? Maybe viable is not the right word.. Does the ret paladin always need to be beside warrior to be eficient ? where is ret paladin`s place in WSG- offence or deffence?
Ooooooooo... This conversation just got WAY different. Hahahaha. Now the sharks(rets) are about to start swarming...

Here are some facts about playing a ret as a casual player:
-Most players will not be excited to see a ret join their BG in a pug. You are a meme.
-Most rets wont put in the effort to reach a status that would be considered viable by most.
-Rets have the potential to be great but this journey is an uphill battle for the casual player.
-The ret paladin doesnt have a defined role in a BG. They are regarded as a flex spot.
-Of the rets I have played with in both PvE and PvP, a very small percentage have been able to pull their weight. Yielding high performance out of this class consistently requires a high game IQ. While the class itself is mechanically easy, the constant decisions a paladin needs to make between healing and DPS requires a high level of situational awareness and communication. Typically this will not be suited for a casual user.

The definition of "viable" shifts wildly between players. Can it be done? Yes. Anything can be done. You could play a melee boomkin in Naxx, because raids dont require 40 people playing at a high level. Anything and everything CAN be carried in every facet of the game. I tend to look at viability in terms of if something is worth doing. Rets can be really fun in PvP and have a lot going for them. Namely the wide array of unique specs a paladin can use in PvP. With the meta shifting more and more towards spelladin and shockadin builds we are seeing some rets put a tremendous amount of points into the holy tree and are becoming excellent assists/supports instead of staying pure ret. Will the average casual user be able to make this class reach its potential with limited experience and gearing options? I would argue that they will not.

We have taken a wide step away from the original conversation though. The original parameters were that you wanted to remain as 1 spec, without swapping and it had to be a tank. You placed a specific emphasis on PvP. Both druid and paladin can be viable in PvP, but not necessarily as a prot tank. The biggest variable in reaching viability as a meme spec will be your dedication and commitment to your character, rather than the inherent strengths or weaknesses of each class/spec. I think its usually a safer option to deter would-be memers from investing time into a spec that requires a lot more time and effort to master because they will likely get discouraged before they find success.

edit: if a post like this does discourage you, you probably weren't going to make it. If a post like this fuels your desire to play, despite the obvious challenges, you are likely the right person for the job.

   moozu123 Zanthir Erik teebling Rocky Aegust
g0bledyg00k wrote:
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@stfuppercut that was an amazing response, I do think I will make it a point to read any posts you do in the future :)

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I feel sorry for everyone who is torn between classes, myself I've always had a clear choice when ever new content or games come out.

In vanilla back in February 2005 I had already studied the info form NA players since it was released in November 2004 for them (correct me if I'm wrong) and had my mind set on Hunter. I stayed on my hunter All the way to to the end of Wotlk. From personal experience and observation I then went straight for Shaman at Cataclysm launch. I then mained my shaman until I quit in early BFA. I also kept playing on my hunter as an alt but my priorities were always true.

Now with the release of Classic, I have no doubt about my choice to go Druid, and will then level an Elemental Shaman as alt (late phase 4-5).

Druids for the versatility and also because they are the underdog. I like performing well with a class that is under represented. I like giving people second thoughts after they see me in-game.

Also, faction has always been Horde, no doubt.

/Mooo

   moozu123 Stfuppercut Selexin
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Warrior Fury
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@Stfuppercut , you are right. When it was WOTLK I tried to main pvp mutilate rogue and enhancement shaman(btw in WOTLK assasination rogue was my fav pve spec). Both spec weren`t optimal and I know what is it to do suboptimal specs for PVP. Didn`t mention that I`m not the best pvper by any means, Even below casual. So yes, Druid it is. Maybe won`t kill everyone, but can run away, which is fine.
Edit: I mean with my skill level

I`m hyped alot about classic, organizing friends , gathering any information about the dungeons , about the classes. Kinda goes a bit more than casual. But the time spent playing won`t be much, so I think the druid has the versatility I need. Thank you ,guys, for your replies!

Because I don`t want to make more topics about myself I will continue in this one.

How do druids gather gear during leveling ? Is it obvious that they gonna roll for +str,sta,agi gear and +int,spi gear both? Or it should be said that anything that is not needed by the clothies can go to me? Like offspec need. Or is it okay to go healer in a dungeon, but roll for dps gear?

   Stfuppercut
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I would pick druid without hesitation.

I used to alt both in Vanilla and paladin was snorefest, however I LOVED class fantasy. Druid surprised me with its sustainability when playing solo. You can solo most of the quests that require groups for other classes. It's amazing what druid can pull off in PvP (especially duels). I knew they're good healers and at least in guilds I was member of, they weren't considered second class healers (I didn't learn about it until I've visited theorycrafting sites later).

However I don't dig tauren druids. I feel they're forced and break immersion. Why not call them Spirit Walkers and make their own version of Moonglade?

   Stfuppercut
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Merode wrote:
1 year ago
However I don't dig tauren druids. I feel they're forced and break immersion. Why not call them Spirit Walkers and make their own version of Moonglade?
I feel you man. I wish Night Elves weren't part of the alliance and were their own faction entirely. I would play a night elf druid in a second.

But, since I'm horde, Tauren Druid it is! And it still fits with the theme of Tauren being a naturistic race who respects the balance of nature, so it's not too much of a stretch.

   Selexin
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Tauren Druids reppin' hard in this thread. Welcome home friends.

   Erik s1atan Justbe
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